Bring back skill!!!

If the International Rules charade has served any useful purpose then it has cruelly highlighted the absolute dearth of basic skills that currently pervade in Gaelic football. While the solo is of no use in the game (you will just be 'bagged') the basics of catching and accurate foot passing are. The two most basic skills of Gaelic football (after tying your bootlaces) and our lads look all at sea in their practise.

Yes our lads have much more of the physicality than was the case in the early versions and yes they can run all day - but they are lacking in the skills required - and this with a round ball!!

Instead of tampering with stupid rule changes like the sideline ball and putting fences in front of Hill 16 maybe Congress and the authorities should look at rule changes that would reward skill rather than brawn and athleticism?

A few thoughts - maybe they should outlaw more than two handpasses in a row? Reward fielding with a mark rather than have the player land and be surrounded by 4 players and have a free given against him for over-holding the ball. Give two points to a player who soloes at least twice immediately before shooting a point (radical!).

Any other ideas on how to bring skill back!

A lot easier than what your suggesting.
Go back to knock-out in the championship, allow players more time with their clubs than with these county managers and hey presto skill level will dramatically increase.
Few positive side effects
1. county boards back in the black
2. Club football in the summer months for the majority of the counties

Negatives
1. Less inter county tripe on the box (or is that a positive)
2 Teams can be gone after one game, but anyone can be gone.

Please note all changes need to be implemented at a junior b game just as easy as a intercounty tv cameras etc type game

Bring back skill???

Another thinly veiled attack on Tyrone football by Jayo....

JimWexford wrote:A lot easier than what your suggesting.
Go back to knock-out in the championship, allow players more time with their clubs than with these county managers and hey presto skill level will dramatically increase.
Few positive side effects
1. county boards back in the black
2. Club football in the summer months for the majority of the counties

Negatives
1. Less inter county tripe on the box (or is that a positive)
2 Teams can be gone after one game, but anyone can be gone.

Please note all changes need to be implemented at a junior b game just as easy as a intercounty tv cameras etc type game

After almost 2 years on this forum advocating Jim's proposal to dismissive opinions, its finally beginning to dawn on some posters the poverty of what passes for gaelic football as we're witnessing. Jaysus, I'd hardly be bothered watching a game today, what with the bunching, handpassing ad nauseum, pulling and dragging and the poorest return ratio of scores from 40m or so. In a lot of these cases, lads lack confidence in their own ability and the fear engendered by coaches means they look for a handy off-load. Kildare, up till this year, were the most brutal of all teams to look at in this regard.
Granted, back in the day, there were a fair share of wides too and the odd robust and "mistimed" tackle, but there wasn't as much made of these things then, if you were hardy enough to dish it out it was assumed you were able to take it as well.
Ciaran McDonald or Maurice Fitz are exempted from criticism in the shooting stakes here and maybe that's why they feature in the top 3/4 of the last 20 years...

The return to knock-out will bring more urgency and meaning to the intercounty champo and will have a very positive knock on affect on club competition. Who, in their right minds, wants to be training for a meaningless league final at the end of Oct. or God forbid, later on...

Now on the national fiscal crises, lets start with a knock-out round.....Minister Mansergh...Em...Er...Waves hands despairingly..coughs....Em.....OUT, strike 1..

I dont quite agree. We had a very good championship overall. Kerry v Cork(Twice), V Limerick. Louth v Meath, Dublin v Cork, and v Tyrone. Down v Kildare., Roscommon v Sligo. We had some great matches and there was an abundance of skill, kicking and otherwise during those matches. Yes I would restrict the handpass and allow the players more time with their clubs but that is about it. Actually overall the football was more exciting than the hurling(final covered up for the previous flaws). Still the no. 1 game in this country.

The first thing that needs to be done by the OP is to define what he/she means by "skill". Only then can we debate whether these things are lacking and whether something needs to be done about it.

Ah jaysus RM - I presume I am the 'OP'?

Skill - well its the art of fielding, accurate foot passing and shooting, soloing, etc. I think the whole game has moved towards athleticism. Players are now clones - hyper fit, strong and could run all day - but how many skilful players are there?

I can't think of many 'artists' - very few actually. Gooch, P Joyce, Kavanagh of Kildare. Of Tyrone Brian McGuigan was/is nearest. Dublin - not sure we have naturals though BB is close. Mayo's Mighty Mc was another. Naturally cos of the nature of the game such players will usually be from number 8 up. Though there have been some elegant half and full backs and Darren Fay immediately comes to mind.

RMDrive wrote:The first thing that needs to be done by the OP is to define what he/she means by "skill". Only then can we debate whether these things are lacking and whether something needs to be done about it.

The basic skills of the game are probably: fielding, defending, kicking and scoring.
These have been superseded by: Breaking ball, getting behind the ball, handpassing and looking for a man 8 yards out to do the scoring...Throw in swarm tackling, sledging and antics learned from soccerball and you have the game as we see it today.....
Training appears to consist of an emphasis on athleticism and physical endurance exercises, tactical guff, diets and aligned rubbish.

The basic and most fundamental failing of all, is the inability to kick the ball with accuracy over a distance of, say 20yds....
But that's not relevant once you can run for the 70 mins.....

How about reducing teams to 13 player a side?

It possibly could result in a bigger emphasis of footpassing due to the longer spaces to play in.

Furthermore, It may be beneficial for the smaller counties who have a limited amount of players with skill. They would no longer be forced to start players that are.. headless chickens!

Sebastian wrote:How about reducing teams to 13 player a side?

It possibly could result in a bigger emphasis of footpassing due to the longer spaces to play in.

Furthermore, It may be beneficial for the smaller counties who have a limited amount of players with skill. They would no longer be forced to start players that are.. headless chickens!

Don't go with the 13 thing at all Seb. How about cutting it to 2 a side for counties like ....... Leitrim. Croke Park is plenty big for 30 .... and even then a good few can hide .....

Sebastian wrote:How about reducing teams to 13 player a side?It possibly could result in a bigger emphasis of footpassing due to the longer spaces to play in.

Furthermore, It may be beneficial for the smaller counties who have a limited amount of players with skill. They would no longer be forced to start players that are.. headless chickens!

Advocating this for 20 years Seb, top, top idea.....Cue howls from the Eastern seaboard as this got beaten out the gate here in the forum's early days....I had to stay in bed for 3 days with the fright....

After the Tyrone V Down game this year my mate just came straight out and said it "you couldn't watch Gaelic football"

Alas we still do but it can be heavy going.

In today's game, Danny Hughes gets nominated as footballer of the year. In the glory days of Gaelic football you would say "and yer man number 10, the one who works hard".

In 1960/61 Down had a half forward line of O'Neill, McCartan and Docherty, still famed throughout the land 50 years later.

In 2060 I doubt if anyone from the current side will be remembered.

patrique wrote:In 2016 I doubt if anyone from the current side will be remembered.

Fixhed!

We won the Hogan Cup when it was 13 a side, back in 1971.

As teams get fitter maybe it would ease some of the pain but the "mark" rule was wonderful in the league before it was jettisoned, and maybe a few other changes and we could stay at 15 a side.

One thing needs changed. When they do bring in changes could they fine any manager who comments £20 million.

Of course managers will be against changes, unless the new rule is only one forward is allowed to score and the Dublin manager will go with that........

Jayo Cluxton wrote:Don't go with the 13 thing at all Seb. How about cutting it to 2 a side for counties like ....... Leitrim. Croke Park is plenty big for 30 .... and even then a good few can hide .....

I'm beginning to come to the conclusion that you're a Labour party follower Jayo....Full of witty one-liners but bereft of a substantive plan for the future....
You wouldn't know what it might achieve until its tried, at least on an experimental basis. Makes more sense that fooking about with changes re: sideline kicks, marks and other hairbrained ideas....

patrique wrote:Of course managers will be against changes, unless the new rule is only one forward is allowed to score and the Dublin manager will go with that........

You are a BIG Eoghan O'Gara fan eh?

It would be like netball, and O'Gara could be the SU (setter upper)

Skill has been defined.
What leads to the lack of skill been shown should be the next question.
Why are people afraid to display their god given natural talents another question.
Football is a simple game, catch and kick.
Score more than the opposition.
I have yet to see county managers adopt this rule it is all about their egos and what would happen if it doesn't work, speaking from experience on this one.
If a player/team has a safety net they will not fulfil their potential but remove it and you have a cracker as noted by RKF in the list of games he called out bar one.
Skill is like talent it rises when required and that is in the white heat of proper championship battle..... knock out.
13 a side I wouldn't knock as it can open up the game but I am a traditionalist so 15 for me (for the time been in)

JimWexford wrote:Skill has been defined.
What leads to the lack of skill been shown should be the next question.
Why are people afraid to display their god given natural talents another question.
Football is a simple game, catch and kick.
Score more than the opposition.
I have yet to see county managers adopt this rule it is all about their egos and what would happen if it doesn't work, speaking from experience on this one.
If a player/team has a safety net they will not fulfil their potential but remove it and you have a cracker as noted by RKF in the list of games he called out bar one.
Skill is like talent it rises when required and that is in the white heat of proper championship battle..... knock out.
13 a side I wouldn't knock as it can open up the game but I am a traditionalist so 15 for me (for the time been in)

Exactly

Very harsh comments on Hughes. He has brilliant balance, is completely comfortable on the ball, can take a score and is a leader and motivator for his team. I will certainly remember him in 2016 but probably won't be around in 2060.

I wouldn't be harsh on Hughes - he's a good player - but nobody shone out in this year's final as a natural footballer. Clarke and Coulter are good too.

But we are not talking about natural footballers, we are talking about skillful footballers. So who stood out in last years final? The Gooch? If you can onlly name 2-3 playes that you consider skillful then the suggestion that there should be 15 of them on each county team is rubbish cause they are so rare. Do you want 15 Gooches? A player the likes of which we will not see for year and years again?

Football is a simple game, catch and kick.

Jim wind the clock back 25-30 years and thats exactly what we had catch and kick and IMO it was no easier watched than the modern day game most games were like fooking tennis, one team would get possession deep in their own half as a result of an aimless kick from an opposing defender. Alas what did they do they got possession took a solo (if your lucky) a bounce and kicked the ball as high and as far up the field as they possibly could, never looked where they were kicking it didnt kick it to anyone in particular and the same thing was repeated over and over again until more by chance than anything one person would get hold of the ball who was relatively comfortbale on the ball and they would have a go at getting a score. It was monotonous fair to be honest.

Granted there was more honesty back then and there was less emphasis on trying to stop the other team playing but it wasnt always great to watch.

it is also worth noting a lot of what is being suggested here would only add to the duties of a referee, unless they decide to take away time keeping etc and so that could be creating as many problems as it solves.

I think the emphasis is now on conditioning and fitness rather than skill - that's all ...

A guy is more liable to get picked cos he is 6" 4' and 15 stone than a nippy little corner forward ...