Best Full-Forward line of the last 25 years

Pretty scary list above and, having just typed it, what struck me was that there are going to be outstanding footballers here who will barely get a consideration for their positions, given the company that they are in.  And then you have genuine all-time greats who are going to miss out, perhaps nowhere more unfairly than at RCF.

Good luck with this lot!

Gooch, Canavan, Maurice Fitz.

To be honest In my view there is clear water between these three and the rest.
If we had to go back 5/10 years players like Matt Connor or Mikey Sheehy would make it more difficult.

OMAR wrote:Gooch, Canavan, Maurice Fitz.

To be honest In my view there is clear water between these three and the rest.
If we had to go back 5/10 years players like Matt Connor or Mikey Sheehy would make it more difficult.

You don't think that Colm O'Rourke is unlucky? I think that he was an outstanding footballer, and would rate him as a better all round player than Fitzgerald (not as gifted, but better in terms of production over his career). I think one Colm is unfortunate to be in the same position as the other.

Cooper, Canavan, O'Neil

Thomas Clarke wrote:

OMAR wrote:Gooch, Canavan, Maurice Fitz.

To be honest In my view there is clear water between these three and the rest.
If we had to go back 5/10 years players like Matt Connor or Mikey Sheehy would make it more difficult.

You don't think that Colm O'Rourke is unlucky?  I think that he was an outstanding footballer, and would rate him as a better all round player than Fitzgerald (not as gifted, but better in terms of production over his career).  I think one Colm is unfortunate to be in the same position as the other.

Firstly Gooch v O Rourke is an easy one. In fact from my view Gooch v anyone any era is an easy one.
O Rourke v Fitzgearld is obviously hypothetical as the choice does not have to be made given the format. I agree with your points v O Rourke he produced top class performances on more occasions, but Fitzgerald could display Genius.
Its a bit like a Bobby Charlton v Georgie Best debate.
If you had one chance to see one game in the hope that either player would play to the maximum of their potential who would you pick  ?

OMAR wrote:I agree with your points v O Rourke he produced top class performances on more occasions, but Fitzgerald could display Genius.
Its a bit like a Bobby Charlton v Georgie Best debate.
If you had one chance to see one game in the hope that either player would play to the maximum of their potential who would you pick  ?

I take your point, although if I could have taken one of them for Tyrone during their careers, I think I'd probably have taken O'Rourke over Fitzgerald, simply because he was always tuned in, whereas Maurice wasn't. I also think that O'Rourke was a leader who made players around him better. That also is the principal reason why I think Canavan is greater than Cooper.

Still, luckily Canavan/Cooper and O'Rourke/Fitzgerald aren't in the same positions, so it's all hypothetical!

I'm with OMAR on this one.

I had huge admiration for Colm O'Rourke but the Gooch is on another planet really.
Similarly with Paraic Joyce. As good as they come but when measured against Canavan, the latter's intensity and leadership carried him home.
Maurice Fitz never exuded much of the aforementioned intensity. It all just came seamlessly to the supreme stylist.

Cooper, Canavan, Fitzgerald it is then.

Cooper , Canavan, Fitzgerald


Shame Ronan Clarke never had an easy time of it.

Thomas Clarke wrote:

OMAR wrote:I agree with your points v O Rourke he produced top class performances on more occasions, but Fitzgerald could display Genius.
Its a bit like a Bobby Charlton v Georgie Best debate.
If you had one chance to see one game in the hope that either player would play to the maximum of their potential who would you pick  ?

I take your point, although if I could have taken one of them for Tyrone during their careers, I think I'd probably have taken O'Rourke over Fitzgerald, simply because he was always tuned in, whereas Maurice wasn't.  I also think that O'Rourke was a leader who made players around him better.  That also is the principal reason why I think Canavan is greater than Cooper.

Still, luckily Canavan/Cooper and O'Rourke/Fitzgerald aren't in the same positions, so it's all hypothetical!

totally agree with TC, at least with O'Rourke you knew what you were going to get - with Maurice it could be hit or miss, could be considered a gamble but no doubt the skills the man had, had to be seen to be believed at times.

Thomas Clarke wrote:

Kieran Donaghy (Kerry) - 3 AI - 2 All Stars - 1 FOTY - Great hands and very agile for a huge man

should that not read great hands and feet for f**k all - dont rate the man at all and fail to see what all the hype is about with him.

bocerty wrote:

Thomas Clarke wrote:

Kieran Donaghy (Kerry) - 3 AI - 2 All Stars - 1 FOTY - Great hands and very agile for a huge man

should that not read great hands and feet for f**k all - dont rate the man at all and fail to see what all the hype is about with him.

I think you're being hard, Boc. I think he was extremely good for a few years, although injuries have since taken their toll. I always thought he had great mobility and ability to turn. He was a nightmare for sides to handle, and played very, very well in 3 of his 4 all ireland finals (guess the obvious exception!).

Check out the goal at 1.05 here in the 2006 final. Hands, strength, great turn, quickness and finish. I rated him anyway! [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Colm Cooper (Kerry) - 4 AI - 7 All Stars - 1 FOTY - Beautifully balanced with vision/skill to create as much as he scores

Maurice Fitzgerald (Kerry) - 2 AI - 3 All Stars - 1 FOTY - Rare skills for a big man; great long kicking off both sides

Ollie Murphy (Meath) - 2 AI - 2 All Stars - Natural scoring forward. So dangerous when fit

Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:Colm Cooper (Kerry) - 4 AI - 7 All Stars - 1 FOTY - Beautifully balanced with vision/skill to create as much as he scores

Maurice Fitzgerald (Kerry) - 2 AI - 3 All Stars - 1 FOTY - Rare skills for a big man; great long kicking off both sides

Ollie Murphy (Meath) - 2 AI - 2 All Stars - Natural scoring forward. So dangerous when fit

Thanks Loyal, but you've picked Fitzgerald at No.14, and he wasn't nominated there. Feel free to change your vote for that position (and No.15 too if you want to accommodate Maurice), or I'll not be able to include your vote for No.14.

Thomas Clarke wrote:

Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:Colm Cooper (Kerry) - 4 AI - 7 All Stars - 1 FOTY - Beautifully balanced with vision/skill to create as much as he scores

Maurice Fitzgerald (Kerry) - 2 AI - 3 All Stars - 1 FOTY - Rare skills for a big man; great long kicking off both sides

Ollie Murphy (Meath) - 2 AI - 2 All Stars - Natural scoring forward. So dangerous when fit

Thanks Loyal, but you've picked Fitzgerald at No.14, and he wasn't nominated there.  Feel free to change your vote for that position (and No.15 too if you want to accommodate Maurice), or I'll not be able to include your vote for No.14.

Cooper - Canavan - Fitzgerald.

GAA-Fan wrote:
Shame Ronan Clarke never had an easy time of it.

I considered Clarke, because I've always rated him a brilliant player. Ultimately, the timed missed due to injury came against him, and he just fell short. I also considered Michael Murphy, and would suspect that if we were to do this again 1-2 years from now, he'd certainly be on the shortlist.

It looks like Cooper and Canavan are well clear at 13 & 14, and Maurice Fitzgerald has the lead in the race for the left corner.

Anybody any thoughts on some of the other nominees? I think that every one of them were outstanding, and it's hard to believe that the likes of Mickey Linden, Stevie McDonnell, Colm O'Rourke, Graham Geraghty, Padraig Joyce and Bernard Brogan don't even seem to be getting any consideration. Guess it says a lot about the men selected ahead of them, particularly Gooch & Canavan.

Early_Ball_In wrote:My full forward line is Mickey Linden, Padráic Joyce, Stephen O'Neill.


Thomas, if it were me choosing the nominees, I would have had Canavan at left-corner forward and O'Neill at full-forward. Had you done it that way I would have had Linden, Joyce, Canavan. What were your thoughts on the positional selections there? For me then, it was a tough choice between O'Neill and Fitzgerald, but I picked O'Neill on the basis of Fitzgerald not starting a lot for Kerry when I watched him whereas O'Neill was, and still is, first name on the team sheet.


I'm also surprised of the lack of grá for Linden at #13. The man is a legend of the game. He played for Down seniors for 21 years (1982-2003) winning 3 Ulster Medals, 2 All-Ireland Medals and 1 of each in National Football League Medals, All-Star & Footballer of the year awards. Most of which has been pointed out by our host in fairness. Two-footed with pace and scoring power which was unparalleled. He was creative and unselfish too.

Excellent post EBI. Credit where it's due. I'd hope that you would persist with such contributions.
We've had to deal with what's in front of us in what, to me, was an excellently crafted structure.

Your point on Linden is eminently valid, but he appears, on this forum at least, to lack the support/qualities of the Gooch.
I'd be old style in the main, a fondness for the manly traits, cunning and killer style of O'Rourke, but the all round class of Cooper will stand the test of time. He was/is higher profile, todays man so to speak, hence the vote....

Just the same, in 20 years, should we/any of us be here, Coopers name will always come up. The fact that 3 of this team will cause debate/discussion
20 years hence is a testament to their standing.

Fair question, Early. Canavan was at his best at FF, and played at FF in 2 of his 3 all ireland finals.  I never really thought of nominating him anywhere else.  O'Neill won an all star at 11, 14 & 15, so I felt that he could reasonably have been accommodated at left corner.  

As much as was possible, I tried hard not to manipulate any of the nominated positions.  I'd love to have separated Cooper and O'Rourke, for instance, but the reality is that they both won all their AI medals at No.13, as did Linden.  

I could also have shifted the half backs around or put Joyce at CHF/LCF, but I felt that would be unfair on the players who were already in those positions.  I also felt that if I started re-positioning players, I'd have unfairly influenced the selections of other posters.

Boxtyeater wrote:

Early_Ball_In wrote:
I'm also surprised of the lack of grá for Linden at #13. The man is a legend of the game. He played for Down seniors for 21 years (1982-2003) winning 3 Ulster Medals, 2 All-Ireland Medals and 1 of each in National Football League Medals, All-Star & Footballer of the year awards. Most of which has been pointed out by our host in fairness. Two-footed with pace and scoring power which was unparalleled. He was creative and unselfish too.

Your point on Linden is eminently valid, but he appears, on this forum at least, to lack the support/qualities of the Gooch.
I'd be old style in the main, a fondness for the manly traits, cunning and killer style of O'Rourke, but the all round class of Cooper will stand the test of time. He was/is higher profile, todays man so to speak, hence the vote....

Just the same, in 20 years, should we/any of us be here, Coopers name will always come up. The fact that 3 of this team will cause debate/discussion
20 years hence is a testament to their standing.

My thoughts exactly.  Linden was brilliant, particularly in 1994, when he played as well as any corner forward I can recall.  Despite this, I don't think that he quite had the class and creative guile that Cooper possesses, nor would I take him over the power and presence that O'Rourke had.  Stevie McDonnell is another top player who hasn't had a look in but, in this company, his brilliance has been overshadowed.

To finish out on the right corner, Kevin O'Brien could well have been more strongly fancied had he come from a leading county, while Brolly would have been in 6th place for me.

Thomas Clarke wrote:To finish out on the right corner, Kevin O'Brien could well have been more strongly fancied had he come from a leading county, while Brolly would have been in 6th place for me.

I'm fairly sure it was in '91 Wicklow took Meath to a replay in Croke Park, possibly in the aftermath of the Dublin saga.
There was a brashness and swagger about Wicklow that replay day, epitomised by O'Brien's lack of sub-servility...

At about 15mins. in with the score level (1-02-0-05) Wicklow were awarded a 50'. I was full-square behind the posts as Lyons pucked O'Brien in the side of the head as the kicker settled.
O'Brien, cunningly, as all greats do, stood his ground, stooped as in boot-tying and rose, prior to raking Lyons' shin to shreds.with a "harmless"
re-positioning move

Great call on O'Brien...

Early_Ball_In wrote:Fair play to ya Thomas, your system here has brilliant. I wouldn't want you to think I was questioning it! There's bee a similar debate on Hoganstand which has descended into farce, whereas yours has been well thought out and encouraged great debate. 


Perhaps it was that Canavan stared at left-corner forward against Down a few times he destroyed us that I consider him #15.

You're too kind, but i'll accept the compliment - and by all means question! Yes, I've been picking on Hoganstand also, but it is well out of control at this stage, unfortunately. What is your username there?

Yeah, Canavan moved to the corner in later years but, to be honest, he was well past his exalted best by the turn of the century. I remember him playing very well in a well beaten side against Down in the 1994 Ulster final.

Just realised that I haven't voted here, with the deadline fast approaching.

Like most, I'm going with Cooper, Canavan and Fitzgerald.

Cooper over O'Rourke was a close call for me, but that says more about my view of O'Rourke than any slight on Cooper.

Canavan was the easiest pick of any position for me - even in this selection, I think he stands out, and I rate him among the best few players of all time.

Fitzgerald was always a genius and heavy scorer, but he also had long periods in his career where he seemed to be going through the motions. However, at his best he was outstanding, and the other contenders (O'Neill, Browne, Brogan, Flynn) don't really carry enough weight so as to edge ahead of him.