Provincial Championship Run-down

I really cannot see Monaghan beating Derry - i think Monaghan have made great strides under McEneaney and if Derry were still being managed by Crozier i would tip Monaghan.

But Derry are a different proposition under Cassidy, footballing wise they are no better but they will be better organised and a lot more street wise. I do think though if Monaghan dont make a brekthrough this year the hole thing could go tits up for them.

All in all it should be a great game of football for the neutral especially.

Would coming a cropper to Monaghan be so bad BE?! It's not that embarassing is it?

We've a league final too so there's no advantage/disadvantage there for either team.

No embarassment at all in getting beaten by Monaghan, i used to get beaten by a Monaghan woman regularly but that's another story!!

bald eagle wrote:No embarassment at all in getting beaten by Monaghan, i used to get beaten by a Monaghan woman regularly but that's another story!!

I know we're really up against it though. It would have been bad enough if Crozier was still there, but under Cassidy Derry will be tougher. No shortage of motivation for Derry, wanting the avenge the last two defeats, they're always tough at home and they have the new manager factor with Cassidy. Their main objective seems to be Ulster and Cassidy has always pointed to the Monaghan game as the target as far as I've seen. But that's our big target too, if we don't win Ulster this year or have a very good run through the back door, Banty will call it a day. It took a while for him to return after the last two years, the Kerry defeats really took alot out of him. He doesn't want to stay on when he's taken the team as far as he can, that's how he'll see it if we don't make big progress in the championship.

MMM - we are targeting Ulster and have been for a long time, i feel our match could be the game of the Championship as it's 2 very good sides playing each other.

I have to admit i am surprised at Banty and how he reacted after the Kerry defeats, that says to me that he hasn't got the stomach for it. There's no shame in getting beaten by the most successful most consistant county in Ireland and if players acted like that if they lost for 2 years in a row in epic games they really should've won they'd get slated for it.

bald eagle wrote:MMM - we are targeting Ulster and have been for a long time, i feel our match could be the game of the Championship as it's 2 very good sides playing each other.

I have to admit i am surprised at Banty and how he reacted after the Kerry defeats, that says to me that he hasn't got the stomach for it. There's no shame in getting beaten by the most successful most consistant county in Ireland and if players acted like that if they lost for 2 years in a row in epic games they really should've won they'd get slated for it.

I understand where you're coming from there BE but Banty wears his heart on his sleeve and those two defeats took it out of him like you wouldn't believe. I cannot describe to you how I felt after losing in 2007, it was simply heart-breaking(of course everyone has these feelings but that was definately my worst), but I can't begin to imagine how Banty and the boys felt. I know there's no shame in losing to the best in the country but Banty was just wondering had he brought Monaghan as far as he could. Anything he does is for the love of the county.

Éamonn wrote:

RMDrive wrote:Tipperary V Limerick ---> Limerick
Waterford V Cork ---> Cork

Limerick V Clare ---> Limerick
Kerry V Cork ---> Kerry

Limerick V Kerry ---> Kerry

How can you say Limerick over Tipp?

Limerick are in disarray, Tipp have just been promoted to Division 2 Limerick relegated to Division 4 of the NFL.

Tipp V Cork Munster Final.

Why Limerick over Tipp? Well the answer is a long and complicated one ... nah, not really. I chose Limerick cause my Mum's from there and I've a great love for the spot.
However I do believe that Tipp will run our of steam and that Limerick will take them.
Tipp's sucess has been one of the real bright points in the League.
We'll see.

It would be fantastic to see Tipp in a Munster final and continue their great year, but I do think Limerick will take them.

Hard to say between Tyrone and Armagh. Tyrone only met one Ulster team last year and were beaten.

1. Armagh - Obviously because they are the champions and I may be biast? And they never really met a 'big' team on the way there but won it all the same. Can only beat what is put in front of them which they did.

2. Tyrone - All Ireland champions but like I said, didnt beat a single Ulster team last year in the championship.

3. Monaghan - A mile ahead of the likes of Fermanagh, Donegal and Derry. A very good NFL run to say the least.

4. Fermanagh - Last years finalists and some argue that they should have won it. Bad NFL campaign could last year have been a flash in the pan?

5. Derry - Won the NFL and are in the final again this year, going well promising talent but havent done much to convince me otherwise.

6. Donegal - What has happened to them?! So much promise has diminished in the last few seasons since they won the NFL.

7. Down - The promise is there but nothing is happening at the moment.

8. Cavan - Best team in Ulster of all time Seanie is the only thing that Cavan have got going for them and thats not a good thing - A lot of respect for this team tho.

9. Antrim - Biggest county in Ulster but worst team in it football wise. Have done well this season by getting out of NFL division 4 are they getting better?

Cavan will surprise, Ray Cullivan, Gerald Pierson, Mickey Lyng, Ronan Flanagan, Seanie Johnstone are all top class. The backs as a unit are poor and that is their downfall. From 8 onwards, they are as good as Kerry. Also the success of Virginia in the schools (and one or two who have done extremely well with Meath schools too) and four or five very decent minor teams in the last few years tell me they should have something coming through. If Cavan have a fully fit team, they are capable of winning Ulster.

Like I said before if Armagh02 if they is you with them teams ranked in order you have some serious orange tinted glasses on, Tyrone AI champs how can you not have them first, Derry and Monaghan as well contesting league finals, with Derry beating Armagh last time they played them in championship. Armagh are mid table in Ulster at the minute and I won't believe otherwise until they beat Tyrone in Ulster.

1st of all Tyrone did not beat a Ulster team last year.

Derry beat Armagh 2 seasons ago. Not last season, not this season. Since then Armagh have won Ulster whereas Derry have won the less prestigious competition the NFL.

No matter what spin you put on it, Armagh are the Ulster champions. You said that they never beat a team of 'substance' this really dosent reflect well on Derry or Monaghan.

Armagh02 wrote:1st of all Tyrone did not beat a Ulster team last year.

Derry beat Armagh 2 seasons ago. Not last season, not this season. Since then Armagh have won Ulster whereas Derry have won the less prestigious competition the NFL.

No matter what spin you put on it, Armagh are the Ulster champions. You said that they never beat a team of 'substance' this really dosent reflect well on Derry or Monaghan.

Fermanagh were going through a purple patch when they beat us and Monaghan, I don't mean any disrespect to them but I can't see them repeating the performance again this year, like after 2004 they didn't come to the fore again for 4 years. Alot of people are basing alot on Derrys championship last yuear but I believe it was a lapse in form, I mean we reached AI 1/4s in 2007, league final 2008 had a bad run in championship in 2008 and reached a league final in 2009 with relative ease....not trying to claim we are the best in Ireland but you can't base Derry on last years championship performance nor can you base Fermanagh on last years championship performance.

Galway, Tyrone, Dublin and Kerry for me in football.

Tipperhairy and Kilkinny in the stick-ball.....

Leitrim could do the stick-ball in Connacht

I agree with you on Fermanagh they were a flash in the pan.

In regards to Derry, you say think that there rating shouldnt be based on last years performace yet you keep mention the win over Armagh in 2007 (which I believe was a lapse in form.

Ok fair enough, the thing that gets me about Armagh is if they have the talent in abundance that is claimed surely they should be getting promoted from div 2, they havent even made a div2 final, and I know people say league isn't important but generally it is a marker for championship.

Armagh are a team that needs time to peak. They steady themselves and gain momentum. If they go all out from the beginning then they will have to play every match with a strong team. Armagh went all out in 2005 to win division 1b. In my opinion the league cost Armagh the Armagh and Tyrone match that year because of fatigue. Only last week they had their proper intensive training session.

In division 2 they get a chance to blood new players afterall they are in a transition period and they get to play a decent level of opposition.

By the way, Armagh won the division 1b final (d2) league in 2005.

Ok ok..I'll reserve any further opinion on Armagh this year until the sunny day in Clones v Tyrone....

They arent going to win. At least I hope they dont.

Armagh02 wrote:They arent going to win. At least I hope they dont.

Ok..just one last point, i don't think they will win either and it'd be better from Armagh to stay under the radar. If they get a good draw they can go far, but theres has been too many disruptions recently with the change in personel to see them win Sam, but never say never eh?

Was it not the Division 1 league outright that Armagh won? I know they were in 1B but the semi's were combined with 1A so they won it out proper. Whereas we were in 2A and effectively won Division 3/4.

Niamh. Honestly, I dont like the management that are in place I think with the team he inherited he should have done a lot better than what he did. It was nice to have Ulster but thats not what we want anymore. The team are going to need constant game time and winning Ulster and then having a 3 week break isnt sufficient.

MMM. Im not sure because we played Wexford in the final and we were both in the same league.

Armagh02 wrote:
MMM. Im not sure because we played Wexford in the final and we were both in the same league.

Yeah but I think that's because you both beat 1A teams in the semis.

I believe you are correct MMM. Armagh beat Mayo 0-19 0-14.

That is correct. I will say this year what i said last year. Kerry and Tyrone are the teams to beat. Armagh, Derry, Monaghan, Galway, Dublin and Cork are all of similar standard and all capable of beating eachother. There is a top 2. Then a group of another 5 or 6 around the same level.

This talk of Armaghs national league form this year is nonsense. Other than 2005 i cannot remember Armagh really putting that much effort into it. Of course the boys taking the field are trying to win and trying to make a name for themselves, but you have to ask how fit they are at this time of year and also the amount of players tried out this year. Few if any counties i would think have tried as many players out in the league this year. I would also suggest that there is not much difference in the standard between division 1 and 2 anyway. (with the exception of Tyrone and Kerry). Derry won national league last year, how did they do in championship and what divisions where the teams that knocked them out?

Donegal won it the year before, how did they do in championship and who knocked them out in back door?

People can talk about national leagues all they want but it counts for little if anything come championship.