Time to stop investing in Croker

I believe the time is right to stop investing in croker at least for a while anyway. I believe any new money that is to put toward stadia should be going towards the capital city ground of each province, ie Belfast, Cork, Galway. These cities at a time like now could do with the investment, if the governments will invest money then so be it take the dosh if not then sit down and work out plans with these provinces to work out a new stadia plan, maybe a new stadium even, or a revamp of the old one in the case of cork as i know its not that long since it was upgraded.

To turn these into state of the art stadia would cost a lot but the money from concerts and the opening of doors to other sports etc (which im opposed to but its going to happen) will generate massive funds which in turn can start to be spent on second state of the art stadia.

Croker last year spent hundreds of thousands on replacing seats??? what surely they should take the usage out of the seats with new stadia and spread the matches. Ie the all ireland semis send one to belfast, cork, galway and dublin with luck of the draw determining where you end up but you will be guaranteed state of the art stadia.

Im not saying take money away from grass roots but the gaa have a budget and im sure there is other funding available out there too which they allocate to stadia maybe its time to start saving and getting ready for the future and most of these grounds are outdated and even the recently renovated dont look modern never mind being state of the art.

What yous think? (should i say what does Jim think LOL)

I would play the quarter finals in the four provincial ground, Cork, Dublin, Castlebar and Clones. Munster provincial champions play a backdoor team in Cork or Thurlus, Leinster in Croke Park, Connacht in Castlebar and Ulster in Clones. The semi finals should still be held in Croke Park. I wouldnt invest a penny in Casement Park, what Antrim should have done was sell it to housing developers when the property boom was flying and invest the money in building a new ground in the countryside somewhere, around Toome direction would probably be good.

Thanks NSG.
Think croker has its own budget - even separate to central council (I could be wrong and will not swear to it).
Games played within each province regardless of the ground goto that provinical council so as in the case of the Leinster (and Ulster for a few years) all games played in HQ the monies go back to those councils.
Really it is up to the separate proviences to upgrade grounds as they own them and maintain them etc.
But I do agree in semis been moved around to grounds like the Gaelic grounds in Limerick Thurlus both 50k plus.don't know what clones holds or even if its the biggest in ulster and Hyde park is getting a face lift in Roscommon but to what size they are increasing I don't know.
But on the flip side- players and to an extent supporters want to play in croker.
Interesting to get a comment from the Dubs what would they make of it. They did travel in there thousands to both Cork and Thurlus.
Will think some more on it.

JimWexford wrote:Thanks NSG.
Think croker has its own budget - even separate to central council (I could be wrong and will not swear to it).
Games played within each province regardless of the ground goto that provinical council so as in the case of the Leinster (and Ulster for a few years) all games played in HQ the monies go back to those councils.
Really it is up to the separate proviences to upgrade grounds as they own them and maintain them etc.
But I do agree in semis been moved around to grounds like the Gaelic grounds in Limerick Thurlus both 50k plus.don't know what clones holds or even if its the biggest in ulster and Hyde park is getting a face lift in Roscommon but to what size they are increasing I don't know.
But on the flip side- players and to an extent supporters want to play in croker.
Interesting to get a comment from the Dubs what would they make of it. They did travel in there thousands to both Cork and Thurlus.
Will think some more on it.

Clones holds about 37000, it would need to be upgraded to hold a semi final. I would like to see Provincial champions play there quarter final on the same ground they won their provincial title. Some form of recognition and reward should be given to provincial champions. Clones or Cavan are the only two grounds in Ulster than can comfortably accomdate 30000+, i dont just mean the size of the ground, i mean access, stewarting etc. NSG will probably have a go at me for this and claim Casement Park is the best venue to hold these games, the reality is that very few Ulster GAA supporters want to go anywhere near Belfast for games. With the exception of Antrim, North Down and a few Derry wans.

Like the idea of the provinical winners getting home advantage I really think that there is some merit in that.
I would even go a step further if they have ahome groung capable of holding the game the should get it. (Venue 30k would suffice as it would be a stand alone game).
This would lead to teams waqnting to win provinical titles again as we all know about "homw town decisions" they happen.
Agree as well with semis they will happen in HQ in football but you may get a chance to move them in hurling, if you had an all munster semi.

JimWexford wrote:Like the idea of the provinical winners getting home advantage I really think that there is some merit in that.
I would even go a step further if they have ahome groung capable of holding the game the should get it. (Venue 30k would suffice as it would be a stand alone game).
This would lead to teams waqnting to win provinical titles again as we all know about "homw town decisions" they happen.
Agree as well with semis they will happen in HQ in football but you may get a chance to move them in hurling, if you had an all munster semi.

Unfortunately the GAA will never go for someting like my idea. Games being held in Croke Park allow them to charge excessive prices because most people are in nice seating as where if the games where held in less attractive venues where supporters had to stand in terracing or sit on the old wooden or concrete seats they could not justify charging people the same amount.

don't know about that Sam, look at the crowds this year they are deluding themselves if they think that numbers are up.
It would be a way of having packed grounds full of atmosphere.
That is what is going to become a factor I believe half empty croker no atmosphere nothing to lift he players and spur them on.
But if you had your idea - home venues for 1/4 finals they would be a sell out and good for both fans and players

Excellent observations from all contributors here and to be commended.
But of course I'd have to be the thing in the woodpile.
As a Connacht man the C/finals in Galway are damp squibs, Roscommon is the best and moist accessible venue in the province.
Mayo and Galway, by virtue of size and Ministerial largesse, have benefitted hugely in the past 15 years while Roscommon as a town and county since the death of "Minister" Doherty is in terminal decline.
Clones is the ideal venue for Ulster finals and capable of holding 35/40k. A tricky venue for access but compensated for by the atmosphere. Probably Healy Park in Omagh is more central but it's possibly 15k behind Clones in capacity terms at the moment and therefore the cost of development is prohibitive.
Munster are amply catered for by Limerick and Thurles but Killarney is too remote.
And so to Leinster... O'Moore Park in Portlaoise is a fine, roomy, accessible ground that can hold close to 40k and would be a great Q/F venue.

While agreeing with NSG that Croker is fine, I disagree with the idea of spending monies in Belfast, Cork or Galway.

Thanks.....

Sorry should have highlighted that this would be an economic and business decison as opposed to we are culchies we hate the citys.

During the Celtic Tiger years a new stadium should have been built just off the motorway in Athlone. It would be in the center of the country and easily accessible from every county.

I think Thurles is an awful venue in terms of travelling to. You would be quicker going to Dublin especially with the new motorway. Parking also isn't great and there are nearly always traffic jams. Having said that Parking for Croke Park isn't great either.

North Side Gael wrote:Sorry should have highlighted that this would be an economic and business decison as opposed to we are culchies we hate the citys.

well its a totally stupid point, why should Belfast, Cork or Galway benefit before anywhere else. Does Clones, Castlebar, Roscommon, Thurlus or any other town or city not need investment or business opportunites at this time. Belfast City centre is full of cranes and building works, it has far more investment than anywhere else in the north (probably more than the rest of the north put together). I do not hate citys, (just as well considering i live in one being the culchie that i am), i hate Casement Park, its a nightmare to get in and out off (worse than Clones), it has no atmosphere, serious lack of facilities and seating. Its just a terrible place to go to watch a game, i hate going near it as do most people i know. In saying that heading to Belfast City centre next friday night, enjoy a night out round there. Why dont the Antrim county board try and raise the money to develop casement themselves the way Armagh county board had to to develop the Athletic grounds, ill tell you why because belfast gaels would soon be hard to find when they are being asked to put their hands in their pockets.

Are you serious easier to get in and out of than casment? The andy town is clear 25 minutes afer a match your lucky if your passing monaghan town after an hour after the ulsterfootball final.

This year antrim fans didnt make it to clones until 10 minutes before the senior match due to one accident on the only road into clones.

Belfast is a city that requires regeneration, clones is a pokey village i cannot comment in that the other villages/towns named.

You just hate belfast and even on a new message board you cant admit it, nothing to do with the gaa just you hate belfast.

The atmosphere in casement when the likes of tyrone play i always find electric and derry the same.

Maybe the belfast lads have give you a few slaps in your mouth during your time here and you just dont like us.

NSG - with all due respect i have to say i absolutely hate going to Casement for any matches, bad in all as Clones is i would rather go there than go to Casement. And i would have to disagree with your comments about the atmosphere at Casement, there rarely is one, though Casement wouldn't be alone in that respect.

Clones is a bit of a nightmare in terms of traffic and there are usually more drunks walking about than supporters. Newry isn't a bad spot and i cant really speak for Omagh as i live too close for the traffic to be an issue for me. Though as someone said Omagh wouldn't have the capacity for an Ulster Final.

samin10 wrote:I would play the quarter finals in the four provincial ground, Cork, Dublin, Castlebar and Clones. Munster provincial champions play a backdoor team in Cork or Thurlus, Leinster in Croke Park, Connacht in Castlebar and Ulster in Clones. The semi finals should still be held in Croke Park. I wouldnt invest a penny in Casement Park, what Antrim should have done was sell it to housing developers when the property boom was flying and invest the money in building a new ground in the countryside somewhere, around Toome direction would probably be good.

Why build a ground in Co derry, more or less?

And would ypou not be better having it in an area with a GAA tradition?

The ONLY thing that should be held in Clones is a nuclear test.

harsh but lmao

clash-of-da-ash wrote:During the Celtic Tiger years a new stadium should have been built just off the motorway in Athlone. It would be in the center of the country and easily accessible from every county.

I think Thurles is an awful venue in terms of travelling to. You would be quicker going to Dublin especially with the new motorway. Parking also isn't great and there are nearly always traffic jams. Having said that Parking for Croke Park isn't great either.

agree Clash, parking in Thurles in terrible! Last time I was over there were cars driving down the pavement in order to get out of the mess of vehicles around the Sarsfield end and the greyhound track.

Personally I hate seeing an empty stadium and think matches would be a whole lot more enjoyable played in front of a full house with noise and atmosphere instead of 50 000 empty seats.

North Side Gael wrote:Are you serious easier to get in and out of than casment? The andy town is clear 25 minutes afer a match your lucky if your passing monaghan town after an hour after the ulsterfootball final.

This year antrim fans didnt make it to clones until 10 minutes before the senior match due to one accident on the only road into clones.

Belfast is a city that requires regeneration, clones is a pokey village i cannot comment in that the other villages/towns named.

You just hate belfast and even on a new message board you cant admit it, nothing to do with the gaa just you hate belfast.

The atmosphere in casement when the likes of tyrone play i always find electric and derry the same.

Maybe the belfast lads have give you a few slaps in your mouth during your time here and you just dont like us.

i do not hate belfast, i hate casement Park.

well being a regular visitor to clones i have to say i know numerous backroads and i am home to Armagh city within the hour after any match, i cant comment on any other supporters casement park experiences but for me the only way to casement park is down the motorway and up kennedy way (motor way usually backed up to lisburn. I suspect as you live in Belfat you would not have had this experience so therefore wouldnt really know what you're talking about.

the one and only fight i have ever had in Belfast was with some slabber outside the St Pauls club one sunday night. It was not really a fight to be honest, it involved a mouth piece slabbering and acting the hard man (as belfast lads tend to do), final straw was when he spat in my face. He got one punch for his troubles. LEts just say it was the end of the fight.

The problem with West Belfast people is they think their city is the place to be and everyone should want to come there. The reality is however that most people would rather go to Clones or any other town in ulster to watch a game before Belfast. Sorry, just the way it is.

Oh so you do have a reason to hate belfast people, typical culchie one bad experience and the whole city is too blame. No bother thankss samin at least i understand now, but just so you know i dont act hard i hit hard, i dont slabber and try to resolve situations in a manorly fashion, im sure you'll be rrelieved to hear that this is how the majority of belfast lads get on.

samin10 wrote:

North Side Gael wrote:Are you serious easier to get in and out of than casment? The andy town is clear 25 minutes afer a match your lucky if your passing monaghan town after an hour after the ulsterfootball final.

This year antrim fans didnt make it to clones until 10 minutes before the senior match due to one accident on the only road into clones.

Belfast is a city that requires regeneration, clones is a pokey village i cannot comment in that the other villages/towns named.

You just hate belfast and even on a new message board you cant admit it, nothing to do with the gaa just you hate belfast.

The atmosphere in casement when the likes of tyrone play i always find electric and derry the same.

Maybe the belfast lads have give you a few slaps in your mouth during your time here and you just dont like us.

i do not hate belfast, i hate casement Park.

well being a regular visitor to clones i have to say i know numerous backroads and i am home to Armagh city within the hour after any match, i cant comment on any other supporters casement park experiences but for me the only way to casement park is down the motorway and up kennedy way (motor way usually backed up to lisburn. I suspect as you live in Belfat you would not have had this experience so therefore wouldnt really know what you're talking about.

the one and only fight i have ever had in Belfast was with some slabber outside the St Pauls club one sunday night. It was not really a fight to be honest, it involved a mouth piece slabbering and acting the hard man (as belfast lads tend to do), final straw was when he spat in my face. He got one punch for his troubles. LEts just say it was the end of the fight.

The problem with West Belfast people is they think their city is the place to be and everyone should want to come there. The reality is however that most people would rather go to Clones or any other town in ulster to watch a game before Belfast. Sorry, just the way it is.

North Side is right, you have just told us why you HATE Belfast.

And you can get home from Clones to Armagh, about 20 miles in ONE HOUR?

I used to have a car like that myself.



We actually got home from Tullamore quicker than Clones. Maybe the Ulster final should be played there.

North Side Gael wrote:Oh so you do have a reason to hate belfast people, typical culchie one bad experience and the whole city is too blame. No bother thankss samin at least i understand now, but just so you know i dont act hard i hit hard, i dont slabber and try to resolve situations in a manorly fashion, im sure you'll be rrelieved to hear that this is how the majority of belfast lads get on.

Who said the whole city was to blame, i would not have been out in West Belfast if i thought ALL belfast lads behaved like that.

Unfortunately your comment "i dont act hard i just hit hard" would make me think you're one of the types i was referring to. Internet tough guy, probably about 5 ft 2" with a major dose of wee man syndrom. If it makes you feel better or you think your impressing people by acting the tough guy go ahead.

Dont know why we are even talking this crap, casement is still a dung hole and rather than sticking to the normal belfast style of waiting on hand outs why dont youse get up and try and sort the place out yourselves.

Patrique, Armagh to Clones 20 miles? SSSSSSh

Samin had a great laugh at your post, totally halarious, includ my entire quote where i also said i like to sort things out through reason.

Im 6 foot 6 samin, honestly, wee man syndrome is something i suffer at the weekends working on the door when the minority of belfast lads act the **** after 3/4 drinks.

How is belfast waiting on handouts for casement? Why if everywhere else is getting renovation grants should or sponsorship should casement have to pay out of their own pockets?

For your info we have club aontroima up at running about three year now they are the backers with croker for the centre of excellence, i would hope the two can pair off again to renovate casement with the help of other grants from other sources.

Now through knowing a development officer for the national lottery im pretty sure they fund gaa clubs and counties throughout the six counties most recently in the Athletic grounds and prior to this the opening of a museum at carrickmore county tyrone.

Us city people shouldnt be allowed that funding tho should we samin, were not worthy off it??

North Side Gael wrote:Samin had a great laugh at your post, totally halarious, includ my entire quote where i also said i like to sort things out through reason.

Im 6 foot 6 samin, honestly, wee man syndrome is something i suffer at the weekends working on the door when the minority of belfast lads act the **** after 3/4 drinks.

How is belfast waiting on handouts for casement? Why if everywhere else is getting renovation grants should or sponsorship should casement have to pay out of their own pockets?

For your info we have club aontroima up at running about three year now they are the backers with croker for the centre of excellence, i would hope the two can pair off again to renovate casement with the help of other grants from other sources.

Now through knowing a development officer for the national lottery im pretty sure they fund gaa clubs and counties throughout the six counties most recently in the Athletic grounds and prior to this the opening of a museum at carrickmore county tyrone.

Us city people shouldnt be allowed that funding tho should we samin, were not worthy off it??

Well im 7ft 2" and hard as nails.

well I'm only 3'9 perfect height for a head butt to into into a place that might do 1 of two things
1. knock sense into ye
2 go back to the whole ulster thing and threaten me ya big(so ye keep telling us) girl blouses

Wonderfully acrimonious posting on this thread....