All Ireland Final!

Shinners wrote:C'mon Patriqué, Antrim were on the handy side of the draw in Ulster and had they faced a Tyrone or a Monaghan they would've been beaten.

P.S Jim, I didn't mention Duffy because he was dreadful and I didn't want to waste my whole evening ranting about him.

Antrim were on the handy side of the draw?

Cavan, the undisputed Ulster kingpins, 38 titles, FIVE all Irelands. Down, the undisputed recent kingpins, FIVE all Irelands. Throw in a Donegal all Ireland and that put 11 all Irelands on our side of the draw, against 5 on the other side of the draw.

Do you know anything about the illustrious history of Ulster GAA? The big two were always Antrim and Cavan until Down came along. All three were in one side of the draw.

The other side contained the nonentities of Ulster.

Man of the match today was probably the referee.

In this day and age when you would need 14 eyes to see half of what goes on, and 12 TV cameras, he did really well having only two eyes and no cameras.

Kerry were the better team on the day but Duffy was very poor. Just when Cork were starting to open up a gap he gave Kerry some very soft frees and it kept them in it. Cork were clueless in the second half and hugely disappointing overall.

Not a great game but exciting enough. And I have to admit I am sick of Kerry winning the damn thing!

patrique wrote:Man of the match today was probably the referee.

In this day and age when you would need 14 eyes to see half of what goes on, and 12 TV cameras, he did really well having only two eyes and no cameras.

P don't know what match you were watching, i was down at the game and Duffy was shocking bad. Kennelly should have walked in the first minute. Granted Lynch is no saint but the Gooch was a cute fecker at making some of Lynchs tackles look like fouls.

I dont think the referee influenced the outcome of the game but he gave Kerry more soft frees than he did Cork.

Why would Kennealy have walked in the first minute?

Oh, he is from Kerry and we are all jealous as hell of Kerry?

Got it now.

Walked my testicles, I thought the free was a bit harsh and the start of the ref favouring Cork for most of the game.

Sure he let O'Connor and Canty away with grabbing people by the feet. The poor Kerry lads had to stamp on them to get free.

patrique wrote:Why would Kennealy have walked in the first minute?

Oh, he is from Kerry and we are all jealous as hell of Kerry?

Got it now.

Walked my testicles, I thought the free was a bit harsh and the start of the ref favouring Cork for most of the game.

Sure he let O'Connor and Canty away with grabbing people by the feet. The poor Kerry lads had to stamp on them to get free.

And if I remember correctly you have been saying this since the start of the year?

patrique wrote:Why would Kennealy have walked in the first minute?

Oh, he is from Kerry and we are all jealous as hell of Kerry?

Got it now.

Walked my testicles, I thought the free was a bit harsh and the start of the ref favouring Cork for most of the game.

Sure he let O'Connor and Canty away with grabbing people by the feet. The poor Kerry lads had to stamp on them to get free.

Its amazing how you always like to be different P. Shoulder charging an opponent in the side of the face is not legal believe it or not - maybe it is in Antrim but its not in the rule book.

And the ref did not favour Cork for the rest of the game it was other way about. But then your probably just trying to provoke a reaction like you so often do

P don't know if that was tounge in cheek or what.
Kennally was lucky but I agree yellow would be sufficent taking one or two considerations into the equation, his Dad and it been his All ireland after his return.
but as regards favouring cork i don't think so Kerry got 90% of the "soft frees".
Marty I think was a bit intimadated by the green and gold and to be honest it would be hard not to be and likewise in hurling a certain balck and amber spring to ming and truth be known isn't it what we give out about with all champs they way they get the soft decisions the "whole time".

JimWexford wrote:P don't know if that was tounge in cheek or what.
Kennally was lucky but I agree yellow would be sufficent taking one or two considerations into the equation, his Dad and it been his All ireland after his return.
but as regards favouring cork i don't think so Kerry got 90% of the "soft frees".
Marty I think was a bit intimadated by the green and gold and to be honest it would be hard not to be and likewise in hurling a certain balck and amber spring to ming and truth be known isn't it what we give out about with all champs they way they get the soft decisions the "whole time".

so Jim are you saying Tadgh deserved special dispensation because of his circumstances - sorry but i dont agree, the ref should have taken action against Kennelly- if it had been a few other guys from different counties there would have been uproar - can you imagine if Murphy had done that to O'Se in the first minute.

I do agree with you though that top teams always seem to get the soft frees. As the guy beside me yesterday said, Duffy must have had money on Kerry to win!!!

bocerty wrote:

JimWexford wrote:P don't know if that was tounge in cheek or what.
Kennally was lucky but I agree yellow would be sufficent taking one or two considerations into the equation, his Dad and it been his All ireland after his return.
but as regards favouring cork i don't think so Kerry got 90% of the "soft frees".
Marty I think was a bit intimadated by the green and gold and to be honest it would be hard not to be and likewise in hurling a certain balck and amber spring to ming and truth be known isn't it what we give out about with all champs they way they get the soft decisions the "whole time".

so Jim are you saying Tadgh deserved special dispensation because of his circumstances - sorry but i dont agree, the ref should have taken action against Kennelly- if it had been a few other guys from different counties there would have been uproar - can you imagine if Murphy had done that to O'Se in the first minute.

I do agree with you though that top teams always seem to get the soft frees. As the guy beside me yesterday said, Duffy must have had money on Kerry to win!!!

not just him but at the start of all finals you have people losing the plot for the first minute or two.
Bad tackle Yellow yes red no.
reading it again sounds lke Tadgh should be treated a bit special didn't mean it that way.
If Mr duffy had down his homework which to be gfair I think he had he let a few people off with a ticking rather than a yellow.
There were a few incidents in the game but nothing that warrented a red card in my opinion. Boc we'll all disagree as we did regarding the penalty in the hurling still agree with the call Mr Kirwan made that day.
Overall I thought Marty Duffy was poor but still don't think keneally should of seen the line.

JimWexford wrote:

bocerty wrote:

JimWexford wrote:P don't know if that was tounge in cheek or what.
Kennally was lucky but I agree yellow would be sufficent taking one or two considerations into the equation, his Dad and it been his All ireland after his return.
but as regards favouring cork i don't think so Kerry got 90% of the "soft frees".
Marty I think was a bit intimadated by the green and gold and to be honest it would be hard not to be and likewise in hurling a certain balck and amber spring to ming and truth be known isn't it what we give out about with all champs they way they get the soft decisions the "whole time".

so Jim are you saying Tadgh deserved special dispensation because of his circumstances - sorry but i dont agree, the ref should have taken action against Kennelly- if it had been a few other guys from different counties there would have been uproar - can you imagine if Murphy had done that to O'Se in the first minute.

I do agree with you though that top teams always seem to get the soft frees. As the guy beside me yesterday said, Duffy must have had money on Kerry to win!!!

not just him but at the start of all finals you have people losing the plot for the first minute or two.
Bad tackle Yellow yes red no.
reading it again sounds lke Tadgh should be treated a bit special didn't mean it that way.
If Mr duffy had down his homework which to be gfair I think he had he let a few people off with a ticking rather than a yellow.
There were a few incidents in the game but nothing that warrented a red card in my opinion. Boc we'll all disagree as we did regarding the penalty in the hurling still agree with the call Mr Kirwan made that day.
Overall I thought Marty Duffy was poor but still don't think keneally should of seen the line.

i agree that most incidents in the first few minutes of a game are treated a little less harshly than they would be perhaps with 10 minutes to go, there is almost an amnesty given to players in the first 5-6 minutes and to me most players know that and push it to the limit with their tackles during that time. I dont think there were any other incidents that merited much attention from the ref but i did think Galvin was doing his best to get himself in trouble. In the second half after the save Murphy made from Goulding if you look carefully you can see Galvin aiming a sneaky kick at Goulding on the end line - he could easily have seen his name in the book or worse if the umpire who happened to be standing next to him bothered his arse to report it to the ref.

Overall though Kerry were the better team - when they went 5 down they refused to panic they just kept to the game plan and if anything doubled their efforts in the middle third of the field to win the break ball - Cork could no ball at all in this area of the field and the little ball they did get Kerry retreated so quickly into their defence that the space to hit ball into was very limited. It was actually funny to see how small Croke Park can look when you have all those bodies back in the one area. Cork were forced to hit hopeful balls into the forward line rather than anything of any quality which was going to cause harm.

I take my hat of to Kerry they are a quality side who just squeezed the life out of Cork yesterday - i hoped Cork would win and i cant say i have any great love for JO'C but you cant argue with what they have achieved this year and the manner in which they done it. The whole spine of that team was taken apart and rebuilt - a task few managers would undertake in mid-season. JO'C is more tactically astute than I give him credit for and i think the jibe of winning easy All Ireland's can't be directed at Kerry this year.

I cant help wondering though, if it was Tyrone playing Kerry yesterday would the result have been the same, unfortunately we'll never know......................

The ONLY referee ever to apply the rules in an all Ireland final was HJohn Gough in 1983.

They never gave him another game, as sending off 4 players was deemed to be bad for th game.

By the way, the team with twelve players WON, so even if all three O'Se's, Kennealy. Gooch and Walsh had been dismissed yesterday, no guarantee the result would have been different.

Now if Donegal had beaten the mighty Antrim the whole season might have been different.

And I think if it had been Tyrone V Kerry the Kingdom would have won 16 nil. Can't imagine Tyrone 09 scoring against that Kerry team.

And if Paddy Cunningham can score 11 points..........

P pointless barbs really, most wanted a Tyrone Kerry final to see who was the best we didn't get it yesterday but hopefully these two will meet soon again in the champ (not necessary the final).
Boc ya your correct that most lads have licence in the first 5mins and more and more are taking advantage but as P rightly stated if you were to apply the rules of the law fully and correctly you would be lynched and not just Catherine at that.
galvin lashed out twice with kicks yesterday and got away but to be fair the cork playeer in both instances didn't make an issue of it.
More I review the game the more I think Duffy wasn't all that bad.
But best team still won but one point to ponder on how many of that kerry team will be there next year a lot of those boys are 30 plus

The barbs are not pointless, Bocerty should know better.

However here is the answer to all.

I imagine it may be difficult being from Tyrone, wondering how come "Sligo/Mayo?Laois/Cork" all beat us but lost to Kerry.

But the answer is simple.

Although
Tyrone beat Kerry, they NEVER beat the Kerry of 2004, 2006,2007, or
2009. In those years Kerry had something different about them. Maybe it
was simply hunger, or this year maybe it was Kennealy, Galvin and
McCarthy.

You can now rest easy Bocerty.

Besides, if we didn't argue now and again this site would soon be boring.

JimWexford wrote:But best team still won but one point to ponder on how many of that kerry team will be there next year a lot of those boys are 30 plus

Jim before the match started yesterday i went to the bother of going through the pen pics for the Kerry team and you'd be surprised at the age profile of the squad. Take Dara and Murphy out of it as they are both 34 and the next oldest is 31 Tomas O'Se Mc Carthy and O'Sullivan i think are all 31.

There is a few years left in them guys yet Scanlon is only 27 Griffin is 29 Kennelly 28 Cooper 26 and so on, like you i thought they were older but it looks like they'll be around for another while yet.

I do wonder though how they'll cope without O'Se in the middle of the field, i thought he was a big influence yesterday and was certainly a calming influence when the s**t hit the fan in the first 15 minutes.

patrique wrote:Although
Tyrone beat Kerry, they NEVER beat the Kerry of 2004, 2006,2007, or
2009. In those years Kerry had something different about them. Maybe it
was simply hunger, or this year maybe it was Kennealy, Galvin and
McCarthy.

So the Kerry of 04 was so much different than the 2003 team we beat, the 2006 team were head and shoulders above the 05 team we beat, and the 2008 team we beat were a pale shadow of the 2007 team. Check the personnel involved P - you'll find those teams were not that different

Where's the thread were you can vote for stupid post of the year?????????????

Really Bocerty I expected better. In Donaghy the 2006 were literally "head and shoulders" above the 2005 team. In the 2005 final Gooch ran riot in the first ten minutes with low ball coming in. As they pumped in high ball for the next sixty minutes to a triple marked Gooch things were different. Donaghy sorted that.

They were also hungrier in 2006, so hungry that they destroyed Mayo who were much better that year than Tyrone. Remember, Kerry do not get sabbaticals like Tyrone, it is the final EVERY year.

I have already explained how different 2009 were from last year. Against Tyrone Canty and O'Neill ran riot. Now Ricey has many qualities but marking a direct running 6 foot four bloke is not one of them. No problem to a Kerry "new boy". Likewise Kennelly was able to keep canty quiet, a feat beyond McMahon. Kennelly is new this year. And the third "new" man won much of the breaks.

The 05 side obviously not as hungry as the 04 team, but Armagh and Tyrone were the best sides in Ireland that year. Wouldn't like to say which team was the best.

This year Tyrone were poor. Waltzed through a very poor Ulster and struggled against a fair Kildare team, who lost to 14 Dubs. Up front Tyrone as a scoring threat really only had O'Neill, who improved after Ulster. Mugsy distributed well, but was not scoring, and Cavanagh all but disappeared. Cork were too big, strong, fresh, hungry, and fast for them.

However, Kerry had two all time greats competing in the middle against Cor, called O'Se, and three scoring forwards who were a threat.

Last year Tyrone talked them into playing an aimless high ball. Not this year.

bocerty wrote:

JimWexford wrote:But best team still won but one point to ponder on how many of that kerry team will be there next year a lot of those boys are 30 plus

Jim before the match started yesterday i went to the bother of going through the pen pics for the Kerry team and you'd be surprised at the age profile of the squad. Take Dara and Murphy out of it as they are both 34 and the next oldest is 31 Tomas O'Se Mc Carthy and O'Sullivan i think are all 31.

There is a few years left in them guys yet Scanlon is only 27 Griffin is 29 Kennelly 28 Cooper 26 and so on, like you i thought they were older but it looks like they'll be around for another while yet.

I do wonder though how they'll cope without O'Se in the middle of the field, i thought he was a big influence yesterday and was certainly a calming influence when the s**t hit the fan in the first 15 minutes.

Boc like you thought they were older.
They'll unearth an young gem called D . O'Shea around April next year.
Give him a few months he'll be back for number 7

patrique wrote:Really Bocerty I expected better. In Donaghy the 2006 were literally "head and shoulders" above the 2005 team. In the 2005 final Gooch ran riot in the first ten minutes with low ball coming in. As they pumped in high ball for the next sixty minutes to a triple marked Gooch things were different. Donaghy sorted that.

They were also hungrier in 2006, so hungry that they destroyed Mayo who were much better that year than Tyrone. Remember, Kerry do not get sabbaticals like Tyrone, it is the final EVERY year.

I have already explained how different 2009 were from last year. Against Tyrone Canty and O'Neill ran riot. Now Ricey has many qualities but marking a direct running 6 foot four bloke is not one of them. No problem to a Kerry "new boy". Likewise Kennelly was able to keep canty quiet, a feat beyond McMahon. Kennelly is new this year. And the third "new" man won much of the breaks.

The 05 side obviously not as hungry as the 04 team, but Armagh and Tyrone were the best sides in Ireland that year. Wouldn't like to say which team was the best.

This year Tyrone were poor. Waltzed through a very poor Ulster and struggled against a fair Kildare team, who lost to 14 Dubs. Up front Tyrone as a scoring threat really only had O'Neill, who improved after Ulster. Mugsy distributed well, but was not scoring, and Cavanagh all but disappeared. Cork were too big, strong, fresh, hungry, and fast for them.

However, Kerry had two all time greats competing in the middle against Cor, called O'Se, and three scoring forwards who were a threat.

Last year Tyrone talked them into playing an aimless high ball. Not this year.

interesting that the years we beat them they were a poor team and yet the years we never got to play them they had excellent teams - i expected better too P, thats like the crap one would read on other GAA sites

OK I concede defeat on one condition.

Why did Sligo not beat Tyrone in 2003, same personnel more or less. Or Mayo beat them in 2005, or Laois or Meath in 2008?

Answer that and I will accept that I was wrong in regard tpo Kerry V Tyrone.

Mind you NO-ONE said Kerry were poor in the years Tyrone beat them, maybe nt as hungry. Maybe Tyrone were not as hungry when Laois beat them.

Mayo did not even play Tyrone in 2005. we were knocked out by Kerry in the 1/4 final

patrique wrote:OK I concede defeat on one condition.

Why did Sligo not beat Tyrone in 2003, same personnel more or less. Or Mayo beat them in 2005, or Laois or Meath in 2008?

Answer that and I will accept that I was wrong in regard tpo Kerry V Tyrone.

Mind you NO-ONE said Kerry were poor in the years Tyrone beat them, maybe nt as hungry. Maybe Tyrone were not as hungry when Laois beat them.

P you appear to have an enormous Tyrone chip on your shoulder, it used to be a hurling issue. Now that has extended to football too.

You have tried to diminish Tyrone's efforts in 2003 2005 and 2008 by implying we never beat a really good Kerry team. Each of the years they were suffering from some lack of hunger or some other mystery ailment that only you appear to be privvy too. It appears to me you have some issue with Tyrone, when they won SAM it was a poor season and the years they didnt you seem to indicate they wouldnt have won it anyway because Kerry were 'head and shoulders' above them. Perhaps you should try predicting the lottery numbers too as you seem well able to predict the outcome of events that never even happened.

Problem with you P is you dont really have any real fixed opinions on anything - you frequently post remarks in an attempt to get a rise out of someone. It frequently works on other sites mostly because the guys who rose to your bait were stupid enough to indulge you. You claim to be the font of all knowledge and yet frequently post stupid childish comments like 'who is the manager of Kilkenny?'.

Still it must give you some satisfaction wining people up otherwise a man of your vintage would have given it up long ago.

Jaysus can people not read.

Here is an easier way. Why did Tyrone not beat Kerry in 2004, 06,07 or 09?

Maybe it was due to injury, lack of hunger, tragedy, and other things.

That does not diminish from KERRY'S triumphs in those years.

So unless you have a boulder on your shoulder, Kerry's woes in POSSIBLE woes in 03, 05 and 08 should not diminish from TYRONE'S triumphs.

If anyone should be aggrieved it should be Kerry with all the crap about soft all Ireland's in 04, 06 and 07.

Tyrone have nothing to feel aggrieved about. No-one poured scorn on their achievements. All I said was they didn't beat the 2009 Kerry team. They didn't.

patrique wrote:Jaysus can people not read.

Yeah, that's the problem all right.

patrique wrote:No-one poured scorn on their achievements.

LOL. Good one.