Overall - a good or bad season?

**Jayo Cluxton** Mon Aug 31, 2009 1:15 pm

Some very poor games. A few very good games but out of 61 to date only a handful stick out. Discipline has been good with little or none of last year's shennanigans - but is this taking the intensity out of the games?

What yis all think - does our ould football need surgery?

**GAA-Fan** Mon Aug 31, 2009 1:48 pm

2009 has been a very poor season, having the best two provincial teams in Munster, Ulster and Leinster - at the time playing againt each other ruined the provincial finals except in leisnster where Kildare stepped up and proved that they were worth challengers.

Kildare v Tyrone was a decent enough match.
Tyrone v Cork was not really that exciting for me anyway.
Dublin v Kerry great to see some free flowing football but it was one sided throughout.
Kerry v Meath was just as bad as Armagh v Monaghan and Dublin v Meath.

I would expect the final to be a lot more exciting but it still wont change the fact that the 2009 season has been dull and boring.

Over the past few seasons it has been Armagh v Tyrone as this decades rivalry and something like that is needed again from either Cork v Kerry or Dublin v Kildare.

Guest Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:03 pm

2009 has been a poor season as opposed to what?

2008? 2007? 2006? What games stick out in those years?

2009, like all other years has had many talking points.

GAA-FAN>>> Kildare proved themselves worthy challengers how exactly? Beating Wexford, Wicklow, Offaly, Laois? Tyrone's subsequent defeat by Cork would make me question how far Kildare have come. Secondly, Armagh and Tyrone have had good games but their games never defined a season. Cork and Kerry's rivalry today is on a far greater scale than any Armagh/Tyrone ever was, yet you appear to imply otherwise.

**RMDrive** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:06 pm

Don't think it was that bad. Don't we get this stuff every year about poor games and poor teams and poor competition.
It started badly and is finishing badly but the middle bit was good IMO. I'd suggest that it is people expectations that have changed rather than the quality of the fare. There were no more great games back in the golden age of the late 90's than there were this year, it's just we get to watch them all, good and bad.

Guest Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:11 pm

Kerry and Meath was a game of defences. The Kerry full-back line of Marc O'Se, Tommy Griffin and Tom O'Sullivan coped brilliantly with the Meath long ball tactic. Meath's backs were tenacious and ferocious in their application of the tackle as well. When you see what the Kerry forwards were capable of against Dublin, Meath deserve a lot of credit for keeping their scores to a premium.

I think in most people's eyes a good game is defined by the number of scores. If thats your thing, fair enough but there was lots of skill on show from both sets of defenders yesterday.

**RMDrive** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:12 pm

Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:Kerry and Meath was a game of defences. The Kerry full-back line of Marc O'Se, Tommy Griffin and Tom O'Sullivan coped brilliantly with the Meath long ball tactic. Meath's backs were tenacious and ferocious in their application of the tackle as well. When you see what the Kerry forwards were capable of against Dublin, Meath deserve a lot of credit for keeping their scores to a premium.

I think in most people's eyes a good game is defined by the number of scores. If thats your thing, fair enough but there was lots of skill on show from both sets of defenders yesterday.

Yesterday was a poor game, stop making excuses.
*Responses involving Donegal games are expected and will be ridiculed.*

Guest Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:13 pm

In what way was it a poor game?

**GAA-Fan** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:16 pm

Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:2009 has been a poor season as opposed to what?

2008? 2007? 2006? What games stick out in those years?

2009, like all other years has had many talking points.

GAA-FAN>>> Kildare proved themselves worthy challengers how exactly? Beating Wexford, Wicklow, Offaly, Laois? Tyrone's subsequent defeat by Cork would make me question how far Kildare have come. Secondly, Armagh and Tyrone have had good games but their games never defined a season. Cork and Kerry's rivalry today is on a far greater scale than any Armagh/Tyrone ever was, yet you appear to imply otherwise.

Kildare beat everyone in front of them. Kildare came very close to beating Tyrone, more so than what Kerry have. So I would be more concerened about questioning how far Meath have come. I said that if Cork beat Tyrone then it would throw a lot of questions up in the air which it has done. We dont know who is better and who is not so good. You use the logic of look who Kildare have beaten to get into a final...who did Meath beat? Mayo arent exactly one of the big teams are they?

I did not say that Armagh and Tyrone defined a season, but they did have a great rivalry - even though they arent old school rivals like Armagh and Down or Tyrone and Derry they still added that extra edge. This decade forged this new rivalry as both counties made a breakthrough at the same time. It wont be as intense as Kerry and Corks but this rivalry is coming back to the limelight. Armagh and Tyrone's rivalry is over its two other teams or even four teams.

**RMDrive** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:17 pm

Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:In what way was it a poor game?

From a meath perspective ...
- Aimless, inaccurate balls into your forwards.
- Slow build up.
- Poor decision making
- Bad wides

From a spectator perspective ...
- No atmosphere
- low scoring

Guest Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:20 pm

GAA-Fan wrote:
Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:2009 has been a poor season as opposed to what?

2008? 2007? 2006? What games stick out in those years?

2009, like all other years has had many talking points.

GAA-FAN>>> Kildare proved themselves worthy challengers how exactly? Beating Wexford, Wicklow, Offaly, Laois? Tyrone's subsequent defeat by Cork would make me question how far Kildare have come. Secondly, Armagh and Tyrone have had good games but their games never defined a season. Cork and Kerry's rivalry today is on a far greater scale than any Armagh/Tyrone ever was, yet you appear to imply otherwise.

Kildare beat everyone in front of them.

Indeed they did.

Dublin and Tyrone weren't put in front of them I take it.

Guest Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:23 pm

RMDrive wrote:
Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:In what way was it a poor game?

From a meath perspective ...
- Aimless, inaccurate balls into your forwards.
- Slow build up.
- Poor decision making
- Bad wides

From a spectator perspective ...
- No atmosphere
- low scoring

Great atmosphere, I thought the Meath supporters on the Hill were a credit. Low scoring equals low conceding, defending is an art too.

**GAA-Fan** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:23 pm

Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:

GAA-FAN>>> Kildare proved themselves worthy challengers how exactly? Beating Wexford, Wicklow, Offaly, Laois?

**GAA-Fan** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:23 pm

Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:
RMDrive wrote:
Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:In what way was it a poor game?

From a meath perspective ...
- Aimless, inaccurate balls into your forwards.
- Slow build up.
- Poor decision making
- Bad wides

From a spectator perspective ...
- No atmosphere
- low scoring

Great atmosphere, I thought the Meath supporters on the Hill were a credit. Low scoring equals low conceding, defending is an art too.

- 32 wides on top of that.

Guest Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:27 pm

GAA-Fan wrote:
Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:
RMDrive wrote:
Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:In what way was it a poor game?

From a meath perspective ...
- Aimless, inaccurate balls into your forwards.
- Slow build up.
- Poor decision making
- Bad wides

From a spectator perspective ...
- No atmosphere
- low scoring

Great atmosphere, I thought the Meath supporters on the Hill were a credit. Low scoring equals low conceding, defending is an art too.

- 32 wides on top of that.

Is it not a defender's job to prevent the opposition from scoring?

**GAA-Fan** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:34 pm

Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:
GAA-Fan wrote:
Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:
RMDrive wrote:
Loyal2TheRoyal wrote:In what way was it a poor game?

From a meath perspective ...
- Aimless, inaccurate balls into your forwards.
- Slow build up.
- Poor decision making
- Bad wides

From a spectator perspective ...
- No atmosphere
- low scoring

Great atmosphere, I thought the Meath supporters on the Hill were a credit. Low scoring equals low conceding, defending is an art too.

- 32 wides on top of that.

Is not a defender's job to prevent the opposition from scoring?

I think the two goals conceeded was more down to poor defending. So its back to what RMD said...bad wides.

The Meath forward at one point had an excellent chance to pick up the ball and put it in the back of the next but wasnt able to pick the ball up but in his defence the conditions were poor. But then at the beginning of the second half a Meath player completely miss kicked the ball when he should have passed it. In no way do I blame the players for the poor standard yesterday and have said it was mainly due to the conditions but thats what happens and in no way can you justify that was a good game.

**Jayo Cluxton** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:38 pm

I think players are fitter, bigger and stronger than ever before ..... but the skills of the game are losing out in pursuit of the creation of 'athletes'.....

I agree RMD that we see every game now and the middle part was fairly good but there are very few good teams out there tbh. And last year was only saved by a good final too. Bit depressing methinks .....

**bald eagle** Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:58 pm

Jayo Cluxton wrote:I think players are fitter, bigger and stronger than ever before ..... but the skills of the game are losing out in pursuit of the creation of 'athletes'.....

How can we get the skills back to the fore in the game though lads? As Jayo has stated footballers nowadays are superfit, however this is negated by the skill levels on show.

Do the rules need tweeking? From a personal point of view they definately do, however a major trick was missed at congress when intercounty managers got their way in the scrapping of the proposed rule changes then. I backed it, voted for it and was pretty disappointed that they got beaten......narrowly!

**GAA-Fan** Mon Aug 31, 2009 3:23 pm

In my opinion I do not see anything wrong with the rules but the way that they are being applied. Referees need to be more consitent maybe stricter guidelines on what is a yellow card and a red. The referees are one of the major problems in the GAA.

Diving needs to be completely eradicated. It isnt in the spirit of our games and it at times costs the better team matches which is not on. My approach would be to have a video referee, actually make use of that gigantic screen in the stadium and have a team play 10 minutes with 14 men, not allowing the diver back on to the pitch but let the team subsitute that particular player.

13 a side maybe? Will it balance out the fitness and tactics used in games?

Definitely not in favour of reshuffling the way in which points are scored. 5 for a goal, 2 for over the bar and one for a wide, bollix to that.

**bald eagle** Mon Aug 31, 2009 3:39 pm

Perhaps we are asking too much for one person to be in charge of a game, is it time for two, dare i say it, like Aussie Rules? The standard of refereeing does need to improve and so does the selection process for referees in big game. Bannon had as much movement in the Tyrone Cork game as a double decker bus on the Corker pitch, and there are far better refs in the country!

Diving is something i agree with you on, it does need to be stamped out however i point to my first statement in the fact that perhaps more than one referee is needed such is the pace of the game and the fittest ref in the country would struggle to stay up with the play all the time, two refs mean that one would be close to play at all times therefore better placed to penalise a foul or indeed a dive.

13 a side usually makes for a fantastic free flowing game of football, but there are pros and cons to this. Needless to say you would have the County Manager Boards (Tyrone for example) up in arms if you are to suggest something that may let more county teams in with a chance of competing, less players on the pitch would mean that "weaker" county teams would have less weak links on the pitch.

I'm not sure about 13 a side bringing back the skills of the game, wouldn't it be more space for these crazy fit players to run around in?

Agree with all you say about the scoring system, that isn't broke!

Guest Mon Aug 31, 2009 3:42 pm

The skill level has improved and continues to improve.

Are you lot trying to tell me that players from the 70s and 80s were more skilful than what we have today?

**GAA-Fan** Mon Aug 31, 2009 3:46 pm

bald eagle wrote:Perhaps we are asking too much for one person to be in charge of a game, is it time for two, dare i say it, like Aussie Rules?

Not at all. Two referee's would be perfect but then it has its cons, Mayo wont have anyone to blame! Joking of course. But Referee's may conflict with their different POV but it could become a great idea if the GAA give stricter guidelines as to what is and isnt a foul.

**RMDrive** Mon Aug 31, 2009 3:59 pm

GAA-Fan wrote:
bald eagle wrote:Perhaps we are asking too much for one person to be in charge of a game, is it time for two, dare i say it, like Aussie Rules?

Not at all. Two referee's would be perfect but then it has its cons, Mayo wont have anyone to blame! Joking of course. But Referee's may conflict with their different POV but it could become a great idea if the GAA give stricter guidelines as to what is and isnt a foul.

Before we can have 2 refs we would need to have rules that most refs would interpret and use in a similar manner. If I took 10 different refs they all watched the same game (without a ref), I guarantee that all of they would call it differently.
There are 3 refs in an NBA basketball game. Invariably all 3 blow their whistle at the same time cause the rules are clear and unambiguous. We need to have this (or at lest move closer towards it) in football before multiple refs will help.

**patrique** Mon Aug 31, 2009 5:02 pm

Before the Tyrone/Kildare game anyone who had seen Tyrone knew that Kildare would put it up to them, playing Tyrone type football. They also knew that Kildare did not have the players to win, constant running only takes you so far.

Cork had the Tyrone game and the players.

Overall Kildare have improved, Wicklow and Antrim illustrated the benefit of the Tommy Murphy Cup, so the GAA have scrapped it, Meath as we knew have some serious forwards, aned Mayo continue to try to win honest.

Tyrone in 4 years have won the title in 2008, which now appears to be a blip as the other 3 years have been poor enough. Too good for anything in Ulster but Ulster football is poor at present, as illustrated by Wexford and Wicklow in the last two years.

I said the Dubs would benefit from losing to Meath in Leinster, and still believe that. Alas for the Dubs they won handily enough, and did not get the chance to win a few "easy" games against non Leinster teams in the qualifiers. Consequently they self imploded in the quarter final, again.

Kerry still have quality players, and although they are not playing well, the quality of the individual still enables them to win. In that respect I think Spillane was right aboiur Tyrone, super TEAM but lacking the individual brilliance, as supplied by Canavan and a fully fit O'Neill in the past. Now there is only Cavanagh.

Cork appear to be the best team, but I expect Kerry to win the final.

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